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Simulation Racing Leagues => Assetto Corsa => Australian Assetto Corsa League, Tuesday nights => Topic started by: Wally on March 20, 2018, 06:21:37 PM

Title: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Wally on March 20, 2018, 06:21:37 PM
RACE 1 RESULTS (http://xgnassettocorsa.blogspot.com/2018/03/s21r4-ferrari-599xx-at-croft-race-1.html)
RACE 2 RESULTS (http://xgnassettocorsa.blogspot.com/2018/03/s21r4-ferrari-599xx-at-croft-race-2.html)
SEASON STANDINGS (http://xgnassettocorsa.blogspot.com/2018/02/s21-standings.html)
SEASON STATS (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nu52lWM6_TIRBEGCTF32BxLe8mobfsCFpd_wOeuxpXI/edit?usp=sharing)

Round Points
RussG   200
Grat   193
Matthew111   184
Mael   147
Shayne   145
killagorilla   129
Wally   109
Phil.8   88
Seanus   72
Jeremy   50
Bacchulum   39
Rob   24
Freezer   19
Dave O   17
JamieP   16
Joe   0
Phil   0

Congratulations to Grat on pole and RussG for the race wins and the overall round win. These two wins were Russ's 3rd and 4th ever in the Tuesday league - well done!

Penalties
Race 1 - none.

Race 2 - This one kept the stewards busy.

The race 2 start incident was a tough one. Jeremy jump started, and then with his extra speed compared to everyone else, he took off down the left hand side of the track, off track. Then when he re-entered in front of Phil.8, Phil had to veer right a little to avoid him, which started a concertina effect, with Shayne and Killagorilla all having to veer right as well, which ended up with Shayne hitting Killagorilla and Killagorilla hitting Phil and spinning him, ending Phil’s race. It all started with Jeremy, who should have checked up after his jump start instead of racing around the field, so he gets penalty ballast for the next round..

With the Russ/Grat contact, the two were side-by-side through turns 1 and 2, but then Russ moved over to Grat’s side of the track, unable to take the turn tightly enough, and squeezed Grat off the track, costing him positions. I judge that Russ had enough time to know that Grat was alongside him, and shouldn’t have squeezed him off the track, so Russ gets penalty ballast for the next round.

Season Podium
1. Grat, 585 pts
2. Matthew.111, 553
3. Phil.8, 496

No change in the season podium standings this round. Struggle Street Racing Crew still hold a handy lead over DA Racing in the team standings.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Joe on March 20, 2018, 09:20:12 PM
I don't think I've disliked a car as much as this one. I did no practice because I hate driving it, but then that means I can't drive it at all for the race. Usually a car I don't really like I can still have fun with in a race but not this one.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Phil on March 20, 2018, 09:22:07 PM
around lap ten my face started beading up with sweat and I could feel em rolling down my face very distracting. Sorry but super hot here atm.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Bacchulum on March 20, 2018, 10:24:25 PM
I don't think I've disliked a car as much as this one. I did no practice because I hate driving it, but then that means I can't drive it at all for the race. Usually a car I don't really like I can still have fun with in a race but not this one.
+1 :'(
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: grat on March 20, 2018, 11:02:00 PM
With the Russ/Grat contact, the two were side-by-side through turns 1 and 2, but then Russ moved over to Grat’s side of the track, unable to take the turn tightly enough, and squeezed Grat off the track, costing him positions. I judge that Russ had enough time to know that Grat was alongside him, and shouldn’t have squeezed him off the track, so Russ gets penalty ballast for the next round.
come on, poor Russ. He had the best races ever tonight and it was just a tough move... yes, he squeezes me, but just a bit... ;) can you at least give him a minimum penalty? like the smallest amount of ballast you usually give? :)
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Wally on March 20, 2018, 11:09:15 PM
Race 1 was intense. I got past Joe after an early mistake, then had to chase Seanus for a long time until he made a mistake and I could pass (sorry about the tangle at Tower Bend. I was trying to stay wide to give you room, but somehow we ended up rubbing door handles. I haven't watched the replay, so I don't know what happened). After that, I was tightly sandwiched between Killagorilla and Jeremy to the end, with less than a second gap front and back. It was great racing - my heart was pounding looking for a pass on Killa while keeping an eye on Jeremy behind. It's no wonder I was "Busiest" for race 1.

In race 2, I unfortunately got caught up in Phil.8's spin after contact. He was rolling backwards off the track, and ended up shepherding me towards the barrier where I had to reverse back to get around him, ending up last but for the wounded Phil. From there I had to work hard to pass Dave O, then Rob who was too gentlemanly as always :) and JamieP. I caught Jeremy and Freezer only they both had some kind of incidents up ahead, probably involving tyre bundles. I managed to finish 7th which was a good result after a poor start.

As to the car, personally I like it. It's fast and predictable although it moves around a little (you can't just mash the throttle, but can still steer it with the gas), and I have dialled out the understeer either with setup or driving changes. It's given me lots of good racing so far this season.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Wally on March 20, 2018, 11:12:32 PM
With the Russ/Grat contact, the two were side-by-side through turns 1 and 2, but then Russ moved over to Grat’s side of the track, unable to take the turn tightly enough, and squeezed Grat off the track, costing him positions. I judge that Russ had enough time to know that Grat was alongside him, and shouldn’t have squeezed him off the track, so Russ gets penalty ballast for the next round.
come on, poor Russ. He had the best races ever tonight and it was just a tough move... yes, he squeezes me, but just a bit... ;) can you at least give him a minimum penalty? like the smallest amount of ballast you usually give? :)
I did feel a little bad about spoiling Russ's party... but then everyone will be glad to hear that rules are rules, and no favours given just because someone won :)
And not intending to take anything away from Russ's performance, how do you know he didn't win because of that squeeze, when without it you might have taken the lead and left him unable to pass?
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: RussG on March 20, 2018, 11:19:49 PM
What an amazing night  :) :) :D :D ;D ;D
It looked like I had really good pace on the practise server but then I expected grat and Phil.8 to raise it a notch tonight and Matthew usually comes in hot on the pace. I was really surprised to qually 2nd.

Race 1 I managed to stay in 2nd off the start and chased grat all race with nothing between our times. I wasn't used to being in this position and was full of nerves and sweat. On the 2nd last lap grat got on the grass after the chicane and I cruised past, then I think I started to shake but still had another lap to go. Somehow I kept enough composure to complete the lap cleanly and take out the win. Really great feeling  ;D ;D ;D 8) 8) 8)

Race 2 grat somehow alongside between turn 1 & 2 so I just pushed him out of the way  :o No, really sorry about the contact grat. I thought you would give it up but you didn't and I think the cold tyres, ballast and the inside kerb all worked against me as well, but the steward has spoken ... All good here mate.
After disposing of grat  ;D I put the head down and went for it and managed very slowly pull a gap to Matthew111 who had inherited 2nd. Kept it clean to the end to take the win again.

This is by far the highlight of my XGN career so far. Look out though, I might get a taste for it  ;D :o :D
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: grat on March 20, 2018, 11:21:03 PM
With the Russ/Grat contact, the two were side-by-side through turns 1 and 2, but then Russ moved over to Grat’s side of the track, unable to take the turn tightly enough, and squeezed Grat off the track, costing him positions. I judge that Russ had enough time to know that Grat was alongside him, and shouldn’t have squeezed him off the track, so Russ gets penalty ballast for the next round.
come on, poor Russ. He had the best races ever tonight and it was just a tough move... yes, he squeezes me, but just a bit... ;) can you at least give him a minimum penalty? like the smallest amount of ballast you usually give? :)
I did feel a little bad about spoiling Russ's party... but then everyone will be glad to hear that rules are rules, and no favours given just because someone won :)
And not intending to take anything away from Russ's performance, how do you know he didn't win because of that squeeze, when without it you might have taken the lead and left him unable to pass?
I can't know it, of course... but the man has 4 wins out of 4 podiums. When he has a chance, he does not let it go ;)
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: RussG on March 20, 2018, 11:24:27 PM
I don't think I've disliked a car as much as this one. I did no practice because I hate driving it, but then that means I can't drive it at all for the race. Usually a car I don't really like I can still have fun with in a race but not this one.
+1 :'(
Really sorry to hear this guys. I am really starting to like the car. When I first drove it I called it a tank because I thought it was so bad, but after some setup tuning, it's become a different beast.
Maybe you have bad setups or maybe it just doesn't suit your style, but once again, I'm really sorry to hear that people aren't enjoying their racing at the moment.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: grat on March 20, 2018, 11:26:01 PM
Race 2 grat somehow alongside between turn 1 & 2 so I just pushed him out of the way  :o No, really sorry about the contact grat. I thought you would give it up but you didn't and I think the cold tyres, ballast and the inside kerb all worked against me as well, but the steward has spoken ... All good here mate.
No worries at all! As I said after the race: it was a tough move, probably off the limit, but smoothly and gently executed. Real racing! A bit à la Schumacher...
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: RussG on March 20, 2018, 11:27:48 PM
I can't know it, of course... but the man has 4 wins out of 4 podiums. When he has a chance, he does not let it go ;)

What do you mean you can't know it?
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nu52lWM6_TIRBEGCTF32BxLe8mobfsCFpd_wOeuxpXI/edit#gid=8 (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nu52lWM6_TIRBEGCTF32BxLe8mobfsCFpd_wOeuxpXI/edit#gid=8)
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: grat on March 20, 2018, 11:50:40 PM
I can't know it, of course... but the man has 4 wins out of 4 podiums. When he has a chance, he does not let it go ;)

What do you mean you can't know it?
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nu52lWM6_TIRBEGCTF32BxLe8mobfsCFpd_wOeuxpXI/edit#gid=8 (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nu52lWM6_TIRBEGCTF32BxLe8mobfsCFpd_wOeuxpXI/edit#gid=8)
?!? I was answering Wally's question. Wally: "how do you know he didn't win because of that squeeze...?" Me: "I can't know it, of course... but..."

Maybe you had too many celebratory drinks? ;)
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: RussG on March 21, 2018, 12:03:52 AM
LOL  :D
I read it as you couldn't know that I had 4 podiums, 4 wins, but then you stated the fact. It didn't really make sense to me, but now it's all clear.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Simone on March 21, 2018, 08:59:42 AM
I cant believe i had a call at 7 pm to go out for dinner with my wife and mother in law......i can not believe it.!!!!!!!!!!!
Hey joe!!  I love this car ..hips of fun!!!!! Especially at Croft it was real fun!! 
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Wally on March 21, 2018, 09:19:34 AM
I cant believe i had a call at 7 pm to go out for dinner with my wife and mother in law......i can not believe it.!!!!!!!!!!!
Hey joe!!  I love this car ..hips of fun!!!!! Especially at Croft it was real fun!!
Damn mother-in-laws... :)
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Phil on March 21, 2018, 10:05:37 AM
Who was in the red car following me? My cars green and the only one in that colour. It was enjoyable while it lasted.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Mael on March 21, 2018, 11:35:06 AM
As to the car, personally I like it. It's fast and predictable

I'll go with Joe, in fact I find the car to be particular unpredictable especially under brakes.

The whole of race one and two were a battle against Shayne with both races decided on the last lap thanks to Shayne's car propensity to eat tires  ;D Sympathies mate I know how it feels to lose positions on the last few corners.

As for Maki Engineering, Freezer seemed to find the car a bit unpredictable as well. Last I've seen of him he was taking a 90° turn into a wall just after the first turn  ;D
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Wally on March 21, 2018, 11:47:17 AM
I'll post my setup tonight, or add it to the practice server. I haven't had a single mysterious spin.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: GzeroD on March 21, 2018, 11:50:36 AM
...then had to chase Seanus for a long time until he made a mistake and I could pass (sorry about the tangle at Tower Bend. I was trying to stay wide to give you room, but somehow we ended up rubbing door handles. I haven't watched the replay, so I don't know what happened)...

That was all down to me. I took the defensive line down the inside but having never done that before I was a bit late on the brakes and ended up carting you wide. Lost an extra place for my sins as I backed it right down hoping not to run you off the track and Jeremy nipped past on the inside.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Wally on March 21, 2018, 12:33:06 PM
...then had to chase Seanus for a long time until he made a mistake and I could pass (sorry about the tangle at Tower Bend. I was trying to stay wide to give you room, but somehow we ended up rubbing door handles. I haven't watched the replay, so I don't know what happened)...

That was all down to me. I took the defensive line down the inside but having never done that before I was a bit late on the brakes and ended up carting you wide. Lost an extra place for my sins as I backed it right down hoping not to run you off the track and Jeremy nipped past on the inside.
All good. I was hoping to maybe set up a possible criss cross, especially if you got unsettled by the bumps.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Bacchulum on March 21, 2018, 12:51:49 PM
I'll post my setup tonight, or add it to the practice server. I haven't had a single mysterious spin.
Spins aren't my issue, I can control the power on oversteer (thanks to Can-Am 8) ).
It's turn in that I find unpredictable.
One lap I turn in and nothing happens and I miss the apex by a metre or two.
Next lap, same turn in point and it grips up, responds and I'm into the tyre bundle inside the apex. ::)

I suspect it's braking related, as I have to turn the sensitivity right up on my brake pedal to get the ABS to kick in, or I'm just not using the full potential of the retardation available.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Shayne on March 21, 2018, 01:51:22 PM
The whole of race one and two were a battle against Shayne with both races decided on the last lap thanks to Shayne's car propensity to eat tires  ;D Sympathies mate I know how it feels to lose positions on the last few corners.

I still look at last night as a win, even though both races I ended up losing the position to you in the final laps. The move you made around the outside of me in race 2 was really good. I was actually quite shocked at how well you did in taking that position away from me.

Last night I really struggled with the tyres. I must of been a bit too aggressive with them, not surprising as most laps I was looking at you in my mirrors and trying to make a gap so they were getting a workout each and every lap.

It wasn't just the car that was giving up at the end, my mind and body were calling it a day as well. I'm just glad I was able to struggle through and finish without making any critical mistakes.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Freezer on March 21, 2018, 02:41:43 PM
My night started off okay but around 5 or so laps in my wheel went into hypersensitive mode and I spun trying to control it.  A quick reset and back going
but well down the pack.  I chased Bacculum all of the second half and he refused to make a mistake, although I did a few for him!
2nd race not a lot better as I clipped the tyre bundle around half race distance and then struggle to keep a badly damaged car on track to the end.  It was
further ruined by the fact I ran out of fuel on the second last corner . . :(:(:(
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Wally on March 21, 2018, 06:13:56 PM
This was my Croft setup, if anybody wants to try it.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Matthew111 on March 21, 2018, 07:06:38 PM
Car was a bit average for me hear, didnt get to change it up much in prac so qual 4th with a meh lap.

Race 1 i got a decent start but couldnt keep up with grat and russ, somehow my pressures were too low and the car was sliding everywhere which compounded into tyre wear which put me back into phil for a nice little fight for 3rd in the last few laps.

Race 2 i made some changes to the car and it was way better and i could fight russ for the lead for a few laps but then he got away towards the end and again tyre wear started to kill me lol i think i may have it to agressive with the cambers or something. The last lap i decided to go nuts to try and build on my 1 sec gap to grat but i instead fried my rear tyre and he caught up lol. Was a good pressure race russ did not blink and the pace was super quick and consistent all race so well done man good drive.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: killagorilla on March 21, 2018, 07:50:39 PM
I don't think I've disliked a car as much as this one. I did no practice because I hate driving it, but then that means I can't drive it at all for the race. Usually a car I don't really like I can still have fun with in a race but not this one.
You've done a great qualifying though considering that's without any practice.
I beat you by just 2/10 and I did prepare for this race...had to learn the track though.
The car feels pretty good to me and I like driving it.
On the other hand I simply do not understand it...really struggle setting it up.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: grat on March 21, 2018, 08:18:39 PM
I'll post my setup tonight, or add it to the practice server. I haven't had a single mysterious spin.
Spins aren't my issue, I can control the power on oversteer (thanks to Can-Am 8) ).
It's turn in that I find unpredictable.
One lap I turn in and nothing happens and I miss the apex by a metre or two.
Next lap, same turn in point and it grips up, responds and I'm into the tyre bundle inside the apex. ::)

I suspect it's braking related, as I have to turn the sensitivity right up on my brake pedal to get the ABS to kick in, or I'm just not using the full potential of the retardation available.
As I stated in a previous discussion, my impression is simply that the ABS is not very good and a little hard to predict. So turn in is really sensitive to how much, when, for how long etc you brake. Notice: I am not claiming I am managing better than anybody. Just that experimenting with it I noticed it makes a lot of difference with very little variations...
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Bacchulum on March 21, 2018, 08:25:48 PM
Yeah, that's my current theory Grat.
Therefore it's probably more my lack of sensitivity to the ABS that's causing my issues. :-\
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: JamieP on March 21, 2018, 09:07:47 PM
I have to agree about the braking inconsistency but found moving the bias a little rearwards helped a lot but I have to change my style to brake effectively. For me it seems to be the bumps that really unsettle the car

Race 1 - started on softs and just hung off the back a little. Made my way past a couple of cars and then just concentrated on being very smooth and making the tyres last. 1st tyre gave up on lap 10 quickly followed by the front tyres and by lap 16, I was struggling to keep the car on track.
Limped home last of the runners

Race 2 - Thought I'd better run the mediums given a higher temp and there was no way to make them last. Proved to be a complete error. I dodged the issues on lap 1 and tried to pull a gap. I knew everyone would catch me but I didn't expect it so quickly. Tried to battle as hard and fair as I could but it was all in vein. Couldn't get temp in the tyres and it was like driving on ice most of the time. Once everyone went by, I collected the tyre bundle and wrecked the car. Came out of the pit almost exactly where I was behind Dave O just a lap down.

I'll be glad to see the end of these horrid things
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: grat on March 21, 2018, 11:28:41 PM
report---short version: nice tense race. Car is hard to drive and passing is really hard. But pace races can be quite fun. Russ was best.

Q: got out first and had free track almost all the time. I can't really ever say I got a clean lap with this car, but had two that were without major mistakes. One of them was ok enough for pole.

R1: I think I made a mistake in raising the pressure for the colder foggy morning. My first few laps were rather good, and I even managed to open a tiny gap on Russ. But after half race my tyres felt really crap. I tried to make them breath a bit like last week, but it did not work. With hindsight, I should have probably eased off a bit, as there are no clear overtake opportunities, but Russ's pressure was high---so much faster on the last 2 corners---and I forced it a bit too much. I paid a bigger mistake when I put 2 tyres on the grass and Russ just flied by. By then, he clearly had a stronger pace, so there was nothing to do.

R2: the car felt better with the lower psi and warmer track. At the start I kept my left lane to see if Russ would chicken out. But he was good enough to send me back in third (yeah, I know, it was a slightly overaggressive move, but which world champion never did one?). From my third place in the train, I had some difficulty choosing my braking points following Matthew so close. We all three seemed to be stronger in different parts of the track and at some places I would get perhaps too close to them. In fact, after a few laps I had to straighten up to avoid him and went off track. Thankfully there was a nice road there and did not lose more than 2 seconds. I honestly felt I had a slightly better pace than Matthew, but it was far from enough to attack him. So I chose to adapt and perhaps try to keep the gap around the 1 second mark. The pace was very high, though, so it was far from an easy task, as any little mistake was pretty costly. Last lap was obviously a sprint between him and me for the final gap, but ironically he made a mistake on the second-last corner and I almost got him. Ended the race in his wake.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Wally on March 22, 2018, 08:30:04 AM
Re the PSI, when it's colder, you typically need to lower the PSI, probably just by 1 PSI all round.
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Phil on March 22, 2018, 09:55:49 AM
Re the PSI, when it's colder, you typically need to lower the PSI, probably just by 1 PSI all round.

Now you say something.....  :'(

What happened to "Optimal"?   :P
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Wally on March 22, 2018, 10:28:33 AM
Re the PSI, when it's colder, you typically need to lower the PSI, probably just by 1 PSI all round.

Now you say something.....  :'(

What happened to "Optimal"?   :P
Ha ha. I just couldn't remember on the grid.
Have you got my tyre pressure app, which has a thread here in the forums?
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Phil on March 27, 2018, 11:34:38 PM
Can you run two tyre apps at once? I think I get an error or something when I try to load it and hence why I don't use it .
Title: Re: S21R4: Croft Post-Race Chat
Post by: Wally on March 28, 2018, 08:04:10 AM
Can you run two tyre apps at once? I think I get an error or something when I try to load it and hence why I don't use it .
You should be able to.