Xtreme Gaming Network
Simulation Racing Leagues => Assetto Corsa => Australian Assetto Corsa League, Tuesday nights => Topic started by: Wally on April 26, 2016, 10:25:42 PM
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Ah, sweet single malt....
In race 1, I got caught up in Chap's spin in front of me, and T-boned him, which put me about 2nd last. But then I had a great long chase of Bafs, not being able to pass him until he ran wide on lap 10.
Race 2 was a bit of a screw up, having brake pedal spiking again. I was bumped by Mael from the rear on lap 3, but that's because I was checking up to avoid running into Bird and Dave O ahead of me, which caused a bit of a pileup behind me. The spiking brakes saw me drop back through the field to finish in 13th
Race 3, my brake pedal was fine again. I had a good race with Bacchulum, Jeremy and Marty putting clean passes on me.
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lol yum
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Fun racing, race 1 was a surprise lol as we started regular order and I was never expecting to get a relatively easy win this week. Still Matthew had the pace on me but I just tried to stay clean and hit apexes knowing there wasnt much he could do unless I made an error.
Race 2 the rolling reverse grid start worked better and easier the I expected. Once the race fired up there were some great battles but I had quite a bit of contact here and couldnt do much in traffic stuck behind Jeremy and Freezer who were side by side most of the race. Matthew got very fortunate with a little bingle ahead of us and manged to get away then turned that into a good win from the back row. Good effort at this track which was very hard to pass at.
Race 3 everyone seemed to lift their game with good driving all round. This meant no easy passes of people that spun ahead and so I jeeded to work hard for every spot. I had a good battle with Matthew with him getting past at one point when I got a little checked up in traffic but then a few laps later I got past when a similar thing happened to him. I think I may have been contact free that race but possibly may have registered a very light contact with Rob at t1 when he didnt see me sneak inside behind another car and had the door closed a bit late.
Will be a video of this race once its uploaded as it was some good racing, race 1 not much action around me other then holdng Matthew off and race 2 was quite messy all round.
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RACE RESULTS
Race Results (http://xgnassettocorsa.blogspot.com/2016/04/s11r3-toyota-gt86-at-zandvoort.html)
Round Points
Marty 67
Matthew111 65
Phil.8 59
Bacchulum 59
Jeremy 59
Freezer 54
Bird 53
StanDaam 51
Mael 50
hylas 48
Chap111 47
Wally 45
Bafs17 44
Dave O 32
Rob 32
AJ 30
Vipergod 16
Flattop 7
Congratulations to Marty, Matthew and Mael for the race wins, and Marty for the overall round win.
Season Podium
1. Marty, 131
2. Matthew, 126
3. Phil, 121
Struggle Street Racing Crew lead the team championships from Achilles Heels, 242 points to 230.
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Hi all, congrats to the winners. What happened in race 1? Seems like you started in reverse*reverse grid...
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Thanks for the 7 points, I hope it was for not causing as much carnage as i could have!
I was stuck in a rut with my times, but followed bird for a couple of laps, took off the TC when prompted and dropped a few seconds.
Just couldn't concentrate for any length of time.
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TC is a big time-eater :)
I had lots of fun. Well, not in R1 - that was boring :D
R2 I've managed to grab 2nd, that was a nice change from mid-pack, and luckily Matthew was nearby to keep me entertained ;)
The best was the last race, though. Chasing through the pack with Marty, then Matthew... not at any high-speed, mind you. Everyone is starting to drive pretty darn good by R3! Then I got unstuck going into T1 next to Freezer (a.k.a The Mobile Roadblock)
Great night!
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Hi all, congrats to the winners. What happened in race 1? Seems like you started in reverse*reverse grid...
Race 1 we lined up on the grid and noticed that Wallys reverse grid wasnt working due to a server build change. So the decision was made to just go as it was, race 2 and 3 we did rolling starts getting into reverse grid order on the warmup lap which worked quite well. It would be interesting to try that with a 2 wide rolling start which I am fairly sure we could manage as lots of the actual racing was side by side with not too much trouble. The sigle file kid of chills lap one out a bit as not a lot of passing is done with the field already spread out a little.
Here is the video from the last race and it seems I had 2 contacts in this 2 both on the same lap with Rob and Matthew but they must have been about .5kmh as they didnt have any effect on either car but I was rather close to many cars during the race, needed quite a few more laps to make significant progress as its hard to pass 1 car per lap here.
https://youtu.be/RQQhSjXY5OU
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Hi all, congrats to the winners. What happened in race 1? Seems like you started in reverse*reverse grid...
Since the last server update, the reverse grid wasn't working, but hopefully I've fixed it.
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Video: great race guys! But even greater envy!!! :(
Marty and Wally: thank you for the explanation. Poor Wally can never take a rest with all these updates...
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Im wondering if the few guys that are a couple seconds slower then others are using tc here. Tc in pretty much any street car is a performance killer and these cars have so much grip you just need a little throttle control to keep it in check when turning or changing direction.
If you turn on the ingame eletronic app it shows whatever aids are being used. If no aids are used you dont even see the app. Its very handy in mp as any server with factory assists will always turn them on by default and you need to turn them off in car. Ctrl t turns off tc but ABS in street cars should be left on as bias is set with ABS in mind and not adjustable making it much worse with ABS off most times.
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In race 1, I got caught up in Chap's spin in front of me, and T-boned him, which put me about 2nd last.
Sorry about that wally :(
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In race 1, I got caught up in Chap's spin in front of me, and T-boned him, which put me about 2nd last.
Sorry about that wally :(
No problem. You and I were both passengers, pretty much.
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Im wondering if the few guys that are a couple seconds slower then others are using tc here. Tc in pretty much any street car is a performance killer and these cars have so much grip you just need a little throttle control to keep it in check when turning or changing direction.
If you turn on the ingame eletronic app it shows whatever aids are being used. If no aids are used you dont even see the app. Its very handy in mp as any server with factory assists will always turn them on by default and you need to turn them off in car. Ctrl t turns off tc but ABS in street cars should be left on as bias is set with ABS in mind and not adjustable making it much worse with ABS off most times.
I used TC in the first race as I did no practice so was always going to be off the pace. Turned it off for race 2 n 3 but still can't keep up with you guys.
I have worked out that there's only three things I need to improve on to be able to compete with you guys though. 1. Steering 2. Acceleration and 3. Braking :P ::)
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Freezer (a.k.a The Mobile Roadblock)
Of course if you were faster you would have just passed me . . :) :)
All round good nights racing. I had many long and close fought battles with the likes of Marty, Stan, Matthew etc all of which were clean and well done. Very important to pick the "right line" and be super smooth as one slip and people are passing you.
I wonder whether a bit more slip stream effect would spice it up as there is next to none at the moment!
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So sorry for the lack of notice and not showing up. I'm building a new PC and totally forgot about it till a couple of hours ago. Probably a good thing for some. :)
Darren
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Freezer (a.k.a The Mobile Roadblock)
Of course if you were faster you would have just passed me . . :) :)
All round good nights racing. I had many long and close fought battles with the likes of Marty, Stan, Matthew etc all of which were clean and well done. Very important to pick the "right line" and be super smooth as one slip and people are passing you.
I wonder whether a bit more slip stream effect would spice it up as there is next to none at the moment!
There is no way to exaggerate slip stream and personally I wouodnt want that. I think the way it is is fine and as you said if your faster you will get past, you still need some form of defense and it shouldnt make passing too easy with artificial aids lime higher draft or even a DRS gimmick.
I find it more enjoyabe if its more challenging and if some people you may not be able to pass all race then thats a good thing not a bad one. It was clear you could pass people and especially if it was not a 1 on 1 battle trying to make a move on the car ahead could make you vulnerable to the cars behind.
This is one of the reasons Ive enjoyed the racing much more in the reverse grid format then regular start races. Sure race 1 Matthew put lots of pressure on me so at least that kept it fairly interestig but looking at the graph from that race it shows most of the field was simply getting larger gaps each lap ahead and behind. Also really dont care if I win races from the back its more of a key to not lose to your near championship rivals, winning from the back will need some luck. Sure your trying to finish as high up as possible each race but the battle with Matthew race 3 I enjoyed quite a bit as I knew that was going to decide the round win and I needed to beat him by a few places and also get the fastest lap which luckily I managed. He got me good in race 2 and race 1 I managed to hang on just ahead of him with him putting very good pressure on me with some solid pace.
Look at the hunter and hunted stats and you can see how many cars were within 1 second of cars ahead and behind all race in the last 2 but race 1 it was pretty much just me and Matthew that stayed close that race.
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Why is DRS always referred to as a gimmick? :-\
Movable aero originated in the '60s and if Colin Chapman's design hadn't caused a crash, it never would have been banned.
It's more like bringing back some purity than a gimmick. ;)
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Look at the hunter and hunted stats and you can see how many cars were within 1 second of cars ahead and behind all race in the last 2 but race 1 it was pretty much just me and Matthew that stayed close that race.
Do not forget Bacculum, Freezer and me in race 1!
Race 2 was a disaster for me, looked away for a moment to find a brand new car parking lot opened at T7? Could not stop in time and thus caused the massive pile-up in the first lap of race 2. I think Hylas was likely the most affected so appologies Hylas!
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Why is DRS always referred to as a gimmick? :-\
Movable aero originated in the '60s and if Colin Chapman's design hadn't caused a crash, it never would have been banned.
It's more like bringing back some purity than a gimmick. ;)
Moveable aero is rather different as I am fairly sure in the 60's this would not have been limited only to certain sections of track and only to the cars following within a certain distance. That is purely a gimmick to try to make passing more possible and its always a balance between making it too easy and not doing enough. After all if its there it should aid in a pass if it doesnt its a fail, if it makes it impossible to hold position its also a fail. Having moveable aero I think in a car not used purely as DRS for passing is not a bad thing, having it as is used in f1 is a gimmick and nothing else.
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My example would be Formula Ford. They utilise the natural aero hole created by the car in front to make passes all the time. They too are under powered yet the effect is there. In these cars there is virtually no tow created however realistically there should be a small one, and I do only mean a small one that would maybe get you alongside....
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I prefer to view DRS as a system that overcomes the aero problems of F1 where overtaking is impossible due to the aero disturbance caused when following a car. Too often an F1 car which is quicker cannot overtake due to this aero disturbance effect. DRS allows them to overtake.
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If there was no draft then it wouldnt have made t1 the easiest place to pass at this track. ;) The trick was getting the line into the last turn when close up to someone was not easy and if you miss the entry exit there then there clearly isnt enough draft.
I have found the draft levels in all official cars to be fairly believable but it also depends on the track. During the race following close the draft was clearly there but quite often at most sections of track I needed to back of or go outside as the car ahead simply needed to hit the apex and there wasnt much you could do to pass them.
Only the main straight was it long enough that even a tiny draft would allow you to get alongside and enter t1 side by side. From there you could make the move inside or out but if someone defended properly it still wasnt an easy pass.
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I prefer to view DRS as a system that overcomes the aero problems of F1 where overtaking is impossible due to the aero disturbance caused when following a car. Too often an F1 car which is quicker cannot overtake due to this aero disturbance effect.
Still in F1 many passes are made without the assistance of DRS. Considering most tracks we are using this season are pretty short there arent that many easy draft passes. Had we had rounds at Monza, Mugello or any large tracks the draft effect wpuld be fairly large.
The way the draft works is you need to be quite close to get am effect in these cars and I think thats reasonable. Its not like these cars are so high drag that you would expect the same draft as if running Formula Abarths ornother high aero low power cars.
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I prefer to view DRS as a system that overcomes the aero problems of F1 where overtaking is impossible due to the aero disturbance caused when following a car. Too often an F1 car which is quicker cannot overtake due to this aero disturbance effect.
Still in F1 many passes are made without the assistance of DRS. Considering most tracks we are using this season are pretty short there arent that many easy draft passes. Had we had rounds at Monza, Mugello or any large tracks the draft effect wpuld be fairly large.
The way the draft works is you need to be quite close to get am effect in these cars and I think thats reasonable. Its not like these cars are so high drag that you would expect the same draft as if running Formula Abarths ornother high aero low power cars.
Especially since the GP2 young guns joined F1 :D
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Still in F1 many passes are made without the assistance of DRS.
That's all down to Pirelli degradation, which they get no credit for.
If Michelin were back with enduro tyres, DRS passes would be it. ;)
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I agree with Marty on this. The draft in AC seems perfectly believable. Open wheelers (even without downforce) have a huge drag factor. But slim sportcars with covered wheels not so much. Furthermore, without high speeds the wake is quite short, so you have to be fairly close to have a significant effect.
As for the DRS in formula one: my impression from watching old races (70s and 80s) is that the viewer had so much less information about tyres, little problems with the car and so on that it made it look like these guys were fighting more. But actually we see plenty of passes today when cars are on different strategies or when someone has troubles getting tyres to temp or keeping them alive, even without DRS. Honestly, the only thing that really seems to have changed in F1 in the past 20 or 30 years is that cars do not break anymore so often, and when little problems develop, they have plenty of sensors to warn them and they can try to change a bit the driving style to keep going. Another issue though is that mistakes got less punitive, as runoff areas are huge. This especially made the arrival of rain less of a huge deal. Think of Silverstone 2014: both Mercedes would have been retired if there was gravel and grass when they made mistakes in the first wet lap.
The problem of the DRS is that if we want to have a fight really for position we need to overcome the fact that these cars rely so much on the front wing grip that they need a help to follow close. The DRS seems to work a bit better than the KERS (or the button to pass in Indycars) so at least for now it is the best we got. Of course we do not have this problem in racing cars that if anything lift more than forcing down, like the GT86. that is why it is easy to follow close in these. But passing is and will always be harder than following close, unless of course you are at Monza. But I find it a great thing to have different tracks with different characteristics. Isn't that the cool challenge?
EDIT: of course once upon a time they could also miss a gear any now and then, and especially in the 80s this must have been a huge issue in battles.
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Of course we do not have this problem in racing cars that if anything lift more than forcing down, like the GT86. that is why it is easy to follow close in these.
Exactly.
Slipstreaming reduces aero forces (both drag and lift (F1 cars produce negative lift)).
As these cars produce positive lift you actually gain grip by following close. 8)
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Still in F1 many passes are made without the assistance of DRS.
That's all down to Pirelli degradation, which they get no credit for.
If Michelin were back with enduro tyres, DRS passes would be it. ;)
I find it hard to believe tyre deg causes people to pass other cars in the first 2 laps before DRS when they are passing people on the same tyres with the same amount of wear. ;)
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Still in F1 many passes are made without the assistance of DRS.
That's all down to Pirelli degradation, which they get no credit for.
If Michelin were back with enduro tyres, DRS passes would be it. ;)
I find it hard to believe tyre deg causes people to pass other cars in the first 2 laps before DRS when they are passing people on the same tyres with the same amount of wear. ;)
Oh, but it does! ;D
Some cars are setup and some drivers drive to care for the tyre, others don't do it so well. ;)
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If there was no draft then it wouldnt have made t1 the easiest place to pass at this track. ;) The trick was getting the line into the last turn
Disagree. You said yourself getting the better run off the last turn was the key . . and T1 was the biggest brake stop spot on the track.
My point is that if you come out of a corner together, shouldn't there be a slight draft advantage for the car behind sitting in the hole being punched out of the air? In AC its extremely slight and I am only suggesting a very minor increase in that area to me would be more realistic.
DRS - forget it!
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Freezer: I think there is enough of it. Not much, but I would not expect much. When you watch races with these type of cars they stay very close and yet there are not so many overtakes.
Of course: no data to substantiate this. Just a casual observation.
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I did upload a video of race 2 as there were some interesting incidents. I did loop Phil but I dont think there is much I could do as he started to spin just ahead of me exiting a corner.
Later I also tagged Jeremy who had to slow greatly exiting a corner as Wally started to spin ahead with them both losing lots of speed at corner exit. From my look at that it doesnt look like Jeremy touched Wally to start his slide but then I finished them both off but again I dont see much I could really do there. Maybe others see that differently but thats at least my interpretation and it would be interesting to hear others.
https://youtu.be/gQvHBetHhnI
Phil incident is at 10:30 and Wally/Jeremy 15:50
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I tend to agree with you:
1. "I did loop Phil". Yeah, not much I can see you could do. But man: look at Stan's move!!!
2. "I finished them both off". I guess it depends on what you could see. From the video, it looks like you had no idea Wally was spinning in until Jeremy slammed on the brakes. If so, then you had no time to react at all.
3. Lap 1: Matthew's on fire! ;)
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Hehe, so you've caused the whole accident at 15:50! :)
(well, as far as effect and result goes - you knocked jeremy into Wally, Jeremy was braking hard and Wally was trying to recover from what I see)
I'm not blaming - I don't think it was avoidable. (although I don't have a driver's eye view to tell) Just stating the visible facts.
Edit: yeah, Stan was very quick to react and did well in the previous one.
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Thanks for the videos Marty. They make good viewing. I haven't watched race 2 yet, but I'm curious about my spin.
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Hehe, so you've caused the whole accident at 15:50! :)
(well, as far as effect and result goes - you knocked jeremy into Wally, Jeremy was braking hard and Wally was trying to recover from what I see)
I'm not blaming - I don't think it was avoidable. (although I don't have a driver's eye view to tell) Just stating the visible facts.
Edit: yeah, Stan was very quick to react and did well in the previous one.
With Wallys had I not been there I dont think Jeremy would have hit him, but I cant see me being able to avoid it as I had no reason to think Jeremy would need to brake after the apex but he had to to avoid Wally.
You can also see the start of the race. The mid pack had to brake just after the start line Which Phil had to brake hard for and Matthew gave him a good push, I was just lucky to have got a bad run to be far enough back and avoided joining in on the fun.
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again; I was not blaming. You really don't need to take me seriously, if there's a big bloody smiley right at the end of the first sentence...
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Pretty fun nights racing :)
race1: played hunter catching marty and when I finally got a chance to pass the wheel came loose so I went touching the sand at t1 then set out catching him again only to run out of laps really not much chance of passing anyway.
race2: pretty happy with that drive to do 17 spots in 10 laps lol got lucky at one point with the spin on lap 2 and getting 5 free spots but hey ill take it lol
race3: bit harder but still enjoyed it had a good fight with freezer for a while there, gave him a couple love taps as I was finding it hard to brake because I have a pretty firm peddle now with the t3pa pros that requires a decent force to pull up and at times I end up just pushing my wheelie chair back haha so its easy to out brake myself now. Came home 6th I think
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Humble apologies for my absence. Been a draining couple of weeks, had a "quick lie down on the lounge" and slept through everything. :(
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I have a pretty firm peddle now with the t3pa pros that requires a decent force to pull up and at times I end up just pushing my wheelie chair back haha so its easy to out brake myself now.
Its a common development path. Upgrade the spring... then upgrade to load cell . . then swap to lockable wheels on my chair....!!! :)
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again; I was not blaming. You really don't need to take me seriously, if there's a big bloody smiley right at the end of the first sentence...
All good Bird I know your not blaming but still had I not been there they wouldnt have got together not that id do anything differently in the same situation again. At times there just bad luck and everyone istrying their best with the racing all round was very good. Makes it tough from the back but thats a good thing.
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I have a pretty firm peddle now with the t3pa pros that requires a decent force to pull up and at times I end up just pushing my wheelie chair back haha so its easy to out brake myself now.
Its a common development path. Upgrade the spring... then upgrade to load cell . . then swap to lockable wheels on my chair....!!! :)
Yeah wouldn't mind trying the load cell but for the time being this is providing a good feel